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Question #: 123

Question: The rods in my blackFoot gantry connected to the x-axis motor are bowing or bending.

Current Solution

We are using the 1/2" rods in the gantry now. You can opt to purchase 1/2" rods and new gantry sides which will accept 1/2" ID bearings.

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Other Possible Solutions to this Question

  • Motor tuning. While motor tuning what are the recommended steps per inch, velocity, and acceleration for the BlackFoot CNC?

    These are the recommend values(default) for our blackFoot CNC machine, the acceleration and velocity can be adjusted as high as the motor can rotate without stalling! Suggested increment's will be by 10's.

    blackFoot:
    X-axis
    “CW8060 (6.0A) Driver”
    Set to 1/16 Microstep, 5.43A
    Dipswitches: 01100110 (“0”=down, “1”=up)
    Mach3 Motor Tuning: 914.29 steps/in, Velocity 400.02, Acceleration 4
    Y-axis
    “CW230 (3.0A) Driver”
    Set to 1/16 Microstep, 2.7A
    Dipswitches: 11001100
    Mach3 Motor Tuning: 1422.22 steps/in, Velocity 400.02, Acceleration 4
    Z-axis
    “CW230 (3.0A) Driver”
    Set to 1/4 Microstep, 2.7A
    Dipswitches: 10101100
    Mach3 Motor Tuning: 1600 steps/in, Velocity 79.98, Acceleration 5

    Additional Information:
    how can we tuning the CNC motor

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    Motor tuning. While motor tuning what are the recommended steps per inch, velocity, and acceleration for the BlackFoot CNC?

  • I need the blackfoot gantry, the red frog router mount, redfrog plug and play with the vacuum pump and pipes connected. Please give me a quote.

    For complicated requests, please refer to our (customerservice@buildyourcnc.com) email. For further help, now this apply's to a custom machine, I would request a post in our R&D section.

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    I need the blackfoot gantry, the red frog router mount, redfrog plug and play with the vacuum pump and pipes connected. Please give me a quote.

  • I cannot turn the shaft of my stepper motor. It not even connected to a driver

    The motor is creating it's own EMF when you try to turn the shaft manually. When coils are connected (or not connected) to any circuit that is not powered can cause unpredictable results.

    The motor freezing from just turning it by hand with no connection is surely the wires touching each other. This is actually how we test if a motor is good or bad. If the motor freezes when two of the wires are touching, that means the motor is functioning properly since the magnets are causing current to flow through that coil opposing the magnet.

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    I cannot turn the shaft of my stepper motor. It not even connected to a driver

  • My x and y motors are on each end of my gantry do I wire each motor to the same XP

    I'm not sure what you mean by XP. Can you clarify? Thanks.

    All stepper motors must be wired to their own stepper motor driver. If two motors need to be driven by one signal (say there are two X motors) then the two drivers will be connected to same CP (pulse or step) and CW (direction) pins on the control interface. If the two motors need to turn in opposite directions, then swap the A and B coil connections.

    Additional Information:
    Whitch A+ or A - B + or B -

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    My x and y motors are on each end of my gantry do I wire each motor to the same XP

  • what are the shaft sizes on the motors in the heavy gantry electronics kit?

    The heavy gantry kit features 1 NEMA 34 651oz-in 1/2" Dual Shaft motor and 2 NEMA 24 425oz-in 1/4" Dual Shaft motors.

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    what are the shaft sizes on the motors in the heavy gantry electronics kit?

  • What are the EN connections used for on the QJ8060 motor driver? I notice that your video seems to leave them unconnected.

    The EN terminal on the QJ8060 driver and all of our other stepping motor drivers is the enable terminal. We don't use this terminal and the driver will function properly if left unconnected.

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    What are the EN connections used for on the QJ8060 motor driver? I notice that your video seems to leave them unconnected.

  • What causes one of my two x-axis motors to stop while the Mach 3 program is still running?

    If one of your stepper motors decides to stop moving and the others are moving during a CNC milling or laser cutting job, then there could be two things that could be causing this.

    - The motor found its limiting torque (usually comes with a not-so-pleasant sound). This is where the control software is trying to move the stepper motor too fast (velocity, or too fast too quickly, acceleration) and the load against the stepper motor (inertia of the machine, or the material against the end mill while milling). Recommended action is to lower the velocity and/or acceleration, and/or lower the feedrate when cutting.

    - There is a wiring issue with the wiring from the driver to the motor. This could be a loose wire, or a chafed wire (or two shorting together). It can also be a loose digital wire from the controller board to the driver. Sometimes wire ties can be the culprit. Recommended action would be to thoroughly inspect the wiring.

    It's probably not the limit switches since that would cause a stop to the entire motion of the cnc router or laser machine.

    Sometimes Mach3 will show a status when something goes wrong, but in cases where the motor is stopping due to its torque limit, then that would not be shown in the status. It's always good to check it anyway.

    Additional Information:
    I need to clarify my situation a little better after going to my shop and trying to run another program on Mach 3. About 15 minutes into the milling process all the motors (2-X axis, Y axis and Z axis)stop but the program continues to run. I stop the program and after a couple of minutes when I try to restart the program all the motors start working again. Then after another 15 minutes or so, all the motors stop again. I checked and rechecked my wiring. This has never happened to me before when running the same programs with the same setups and motor speeds. All of a sudden when I reloaded a program I successfully used before it does this. Do you have any recommendations?

    Additional Information:
    Yeah, it sounds like a more complex issue. Have you tried running in the air without using the spindle. This may be a power related issue.

    Additional Information:
    That's exactly what I did. I ran the program without the router motor on just to see if the motors would get through the whole program but they stopped working after about fifteen minutes and then I was able to start them again after about 3 or 4 minutes. I never had this problem before so you can imagine my frustration especially after ruining a couple of projects on expensive material.

    Additional Information:
    Sure. I can completely understand. Try this: disconnect all but one of the driver from power and digital connection and do the air run. Repeat this for each driver and note your findings. This will rule out the drivers causing a power failure.

    Also, is your stepper motors and drivers on a separate power circuit from the computer?

    Additional Information:
    I will try disconnecting each driver and digital connection, which will be a real pain because it will be hard to access.

    All the stepper motors, drivers and computer are plugged into the same power strip.

    Additional Information:
    Ok, so there is no power failure going on, but I believe it is necessary to test each stepper motor and driver pair individually. Hopefully that will lead to a conclusion.

    Additional Information:
    It will take a little time but I will do it and report back on my findings.

    Additional Information:
    Curious, what machine is exhibiting this problem?

    Additional Information:
    I purchased a BYCNC kit back in 2009 with an approximate cutting area of 2' X 4'. I later changed out the Z-Axis Motor and controller for a larger one and have two X-axis motors and controllers. In 2010 I rebuilt the machine out of birch plywood instead of the particle board that the kit supplied. I sent Patrick pictures to him. The machine never gave me a problem till now.

    Additional Information:
    Thanks for the update. This is Patrick by the way. I answer pretty much all of the Customer Service questions. That machine has given quite a good history.

    Additional Information:
    I love the machine and made a number of samples of my work for my e-commerce site, but I can't start selling product until I know this problem is solved because I will not be able to fulfill orders. I finally got all the electronics out of its enclosed protected area near the machine so that I test each controller as you recommended. I hope the problem can be rectified. Will let you know.

    Additional Information:
    Thanks.

    Additional Information:
    I tested each stepper motor and driver pair individually and they worked so what might be the next step?

    Additional Information:
    Did each stepper motor driver pair work for the full +15 minutes?

    Additional Information:
    Yes, I had them in operation for over 30 minutes.

    Additional Information:
    Ok, well it’s good that the motors and driver are ok. We are now down to the power supply and the breakout board as possible causes for the stop. I have a feeling it may be the power supply where with all three drivers drawing current and the power supply maybe getting too hot. Is the fan in the power supply working? You can also test to see if there is 36 volts on the power supply voltage output (V+ and V-).

    Regarding the breakout board, if you have an oscilloscope, you can test if the driver pulses are outputting, but I would consider this as a last resort after you determine if there is a problem with the power supply.

    Additional Information:
    I tested the power supply with a voltmeter and each output was registering 39-40 volts. I think the problem may be the g-code. I am using V-Carve pro to do design and output to Mach 3 Mill g-code. When I studied the g-code lines I noticed that further into the program the z-axis g-code stopped zeroing out to move to the next part of the carving. In other words both the x and y keep moving and the z just stopped working because there was g-code missing. I think something is missing when the design was converted to g-code. I noticed that when I ran a simpler project it worked without problems so I need to investigate this further.

    Additional Information:
    New Update, Its not the g-code. I started to run the long program and everything was working fine until about 45 minutes into it, all the motors stopped working (but the program was still running) and there was a high pitched hum. When I put my hands on the motors they were all trying to move but it seemed they were all stalled. I turned the power off, gave it a minute and when I turned it back on I was able to move the motors again. Could this be a power supply problem?

    Additional Information:
    It does sound more and more like a power supply problem. Did you test the power supply after the motors stopped?

    Additional Information:
    No, I did not. What should I be looking for.

    Additional Information:
    It’s good that you know the voltage during normal operation, so you have a base understood. If the power supply is the problem, the voltage will be reduced or non existent when measured after the problem.

    Additional Information:
    Also, check to see if the fan is running on the power supply when the motors stop. That may (not absolutely) be an indication.

    Additional Information:
    I'll run another test, check the voltage and fan when the problem occurs and let you know. Thanks for hanging in there with me as we try to resolve the problem.

    Additional Information:
    It’s my pleasure. This service is rarely used and is faster then email. Odd nobody uses it. Any recommendations you can give would be great. No problem using this FAQ to pose ideas as this resolution will be cleaned up later.

    Additional Information:
    It might be that people do not realize you can communicate through the sight like this because they are so used to e-mail and texting. You may want to explain this feature in the customer service section.

    I ran the program this morning and it did not take long before the motors stopped. While operating the voltages for all three motors was 46 volts, when the motors stalled (and again there was a high pitch hum) the voltage went up to 60 volts and the fan on the power supply was operating.

    Additional Information:
    So, the driver work individually, but not all together. There is a high pitch sound when the motors fail. You have noted 60 volts from the power supply and the supply fan remains on. This is a difficult issue to resolve, but it seems to me that your power supply may be bad. The 60v measurement tells me that the current dropped and ohms law tells us that is current drops, volts will rise if the resistance stays the same.

    Additional Information:
    As one last test I am going to test each driver again and let them go through the entire program because it seems that the failure can occur at the beginning or towards the end of the program. When I originally tested ach driver I let them run for about a half an hour and the program takes over an hour to run completely. I just want to make sure that it is not the drivers. I will report back when I finished but as you noted it may be the power supply but I want to make sure.

    Additional Information:
    That’s a great idea.

    Additional Information:
    I just ran the x-axis through the whole program and there was no problem especially since I have two NEMA 23 motors moving that axis. Before I check the Y and Z could having a NEMA 34 on the Z axis with appropriate controller be a problem. I used the larger motor on the z axis because the router I am using is a large 1 1/2 hp. I've run this program in the past with this set-up and have not had a problem.

    Additional Information:
    Having a, say 3.0 amp driver, driving a stepper motor that typically requires a 6 amp driver would not seem to be an issue since the driver is limiting the current draw, but the driver may not be able to handle larger coil and back EMF with the protection on the 3.0 amp driver. With that said, I don’t believe that is the issue in this case.

    Additional Information:
    I don't either because I was able to run this and other complicated programs with this set-up in the past. I will let you know on the y and z axis.

    Additional Information:
    Thanks

    Additional Information:
    I ran the Y axis and z axis separately through the entire program and there was no stopping or problem. I guess the culprit is the power supply and I'll order a new one and hope that resolves the problem.

    Additional Information:
    Yes, that is the most probable cause. Please keep me informed. Thanks!

    Additional Information:
    Received and installed the new power supply. I ran the program with the router on and it worked flawlessly. The program runs for an hour and a half and I did not have a single problem. I guess it was the power supply but I was glad to go through all the diagnostics we discussed before replacing it. I hope this power supply lasts a lot longer than the last one. Thanks much for hanging in there with me and coming up with the solution.

    Additional Information:
    It’s my absolute pleasure and I am so happy to hear that the power supply replacement solved the problem.

    Additional Information:

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    What causes one of my two x-axis motors to stop while the Mach 3 program is still running?

  • the rods in the gantry are bowing

    We are using the 1/2" rods in the gantry now. You can opt to purchase 1/2" rods and new gantry sides which will accept 1/2" ID bearings.

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    the rods in the gantry are bowing

  • one of my motors from the blackfoot kit goes back and forth rather than turning, the wiring hasnt changed since i bought it, what could be wrong?

    The motor shaft does not turn, but slides back and forth in an axial motion? Please submit additional information on this page.

    Additional Information:
    it goes one step then the next step in the other direction so it seems to just vibrate

    Additional Information:
    It sounds like this could be a bad driver? You can determine if this is the cause by connecting another motor to this driver to see if it still happens to the new motor plugged into that driver. This will either rule out the motor causing this, or if it is the driver.

    You can also possibly rule out the driver as well if you change the step and direction wires from another driver to the problem driver.

    Make sure you do these steps one at a time. It's best to consider a single variable at a time.

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    one of my motors from the blackfoot kit goes back and forth rather than turning, the wiring hasnt changed since i bought it, what could be wrong?

  • How far does the X axis of the blackfoot travel per turn of the stepper motor ?

    The amount traveled per turn in our blackFoot, will be dependent on the steps per inch settings that you will implement to your drivers and within the software (mach3 (ex)) motor tunning: steps per inch/ 1422.22, 1/4 on your driver will give you a different distance if used as 1/2 or 1/8 etc.


    Here is a in depth tutorial on how to find the correct steps per inch for a specifications: (

    )

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    How far does the X axis of the blackfoot travel per turn of the stepper motor ?

  • in the 3 Axis Electronics Combo (For Heavy Gantry) the 651oz motor is a dual shaft ?

    The 651 oz/in NEMA 34 stepper motor does have a dual shaft. The shaft extends 19 mm at both ends.

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    in the 3 Axis Electronics Combo (For Heavy Gantry) the 651oz motor is a dual shaft ?

  • Planning to Buy Greenbull or Blackfoot 4'x 8' Long "Z" Axis. My questions are: what is the hight between the table and the Gantry ? what maximun Z can useful engraving? if I instal a rotating 4 Axle. what maximun diameter can be useful.

    Only our greenBull CNC machines will be able to use the long Z-axis, due to structural construction of the greenBull over the blackFoot.
    The height from the table top to the bottom of the gantry is: 4.25"

    Both the maximum cutting height and diameter, will be dependent on the specific end mill/router bit you plan on using, since they can vary in length.
    The maximum cutting height (useful to engrave or cut material)is: with spoil-board 3.875", without a spoil-board is 4.625"
    The maximum diameter will (estimated) is: 3"

    Specifically dealing with our greenBull long Z-axis CNC machines, depending on how you specifically design the table you can have more cutting height and a larger diameter clearance. If you only create a frame for the machine with a hollow center(adjustable midsection), allowing you to have a greater clearance.
    Similar table image here: (https://buildyourcnc.com/Item/cnc-machine-greenBull-v4-6X#prettyPhoto/5/)

    Click the link to respond:
    Planning to Buy Greenbull or Blackfoot 4'x 8' Long "Z" Axis. My questions are: what is the hight between the table and the Gantry ? what maximun Z can useful engraving? if I instal a rotating 4 Axle. what maximun diameter can be useful.

  • what are all the settings i'd need for mach3 for use with a blackfoot and a redfly?

    These are the recommend values(default) for our blackFoot CNC machine, the acceleration and velocity can be adjusted as high as the motor can rotate without stalling! Suggested increment's will be by 10's.

    blackFoot:
    X-axis
    “CW8060 (6.0A) Driver”
    Set to 1/16 Microstep, 5.43A
    Dipswitches: 01100110 (“0”=down, “1”=up)
    Mach3 Motor Tuning: 914.29 steps/in, Velocity 400.02, Acceleration 4
    Y-axis
    “CW230 (3.0A) Driver”
    Set to 1/16 Microstep, 2.7A
    Dipswitches: 11001100
    Mach3 Motor Tuning: 1422.22 steps/in, Velocity 400.02, Acceleration 4
    Z-axis
    “CW230 (3.0A) Driver”
    Set to 1/4 Microstep, 2.7A
    Dipswitches: 10101100
    Mach3 Motor Tuning: 1600 steps/in, Velocity 79.98, Acceleration 5

    Additional Information:
    how can we tuning the CNC motor

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    what are all the settings i'd need for mach3 for use with a blackfoot and a redfly?

  • stepper motor runs smooth then rough for a moment then smooth, etc. Does this at all steps, and connected motors.

    This sounds like it could be a loose wire, or poor connection with the motor wires. Make sure all wires that are to be connected to each other are soldered and use a lineman's splice when putting the wires together. Also, make sure that the wires going into the driver is securely fastened.

    If this is an issue where the motors have run well for a long time then just started to show this performance issue, then make sure that there are no wire ties or other binding method that is chaffing the wires. This would make the motors run oddly at certain travel positions where the chafing has caused a short with the wires.

    If this is an issue where you don't have the motor plugged in at all and are just trying to turn it by hand and this phenomenon is occuring, then make sure all of the wires are not touching each other. When wires are touching each other and you are trying to spin the shaft by hand, the motor will feed current back into the motor making it difficult to turn.

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    stepper motor runs smooth then rough for a moment then smooth, etc. Does this at all steps, and connected motors.

  • With the Mach3 USB board, my stepper motors are moving or spinning slowly.

    If your motors turn very slowly using your Mach3 USB board, then either the pulse from the board is being output at a slow rate or the motor drivers are set to a higher than expected microstepping:

    The Mach3 USB board outputs the pulse rather than the computer, but Mach3 controls this pulse frequency within the motor tuning section. First, determine if the travel distance is correct with the computer and the physical travel of the machine.

    If the travel is different, then your stepper motor driver's microstepping is incorrect, or the steps per inch/mm in the motor tuning within Mach3 is incorrect.

    If the travel is correct, then simply change the velocity and acceleration parameters to your desired level. If Mach3 will not achieve the velocity you desire, then decrease your stepper motor driver's microstepping setting, readjust the step per inch/mm in mach3 and readjust the acceleration and velocity to your desired levels.

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    With the Mach3 USB board, my stepper motors are moving or spinning slowly.

  • 4 axis kit can I use 2 motors for the gantry with one controller card? or I buy the 3 axis kit instead?

    Yes, you can use the 4 axis kit and use two of the motors on the gantry. You will need to wire the gantry axis motors to the same step and direction signals on the controller interface. For example, if the gantry axis is the X axis, then on the controller step and direction terminals (CP and CW) is wired to both of the stepper motor drivers for the X axis.

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    4 axis kit can I use 2 motors for the gantry with one controller card? or I buy the 3 axis kit instead?

  • HOW MUCH MOTOR CABLE FOR THE BLACKFOOT?

    The motor cables for the blackToe are as follows:

    Total 30 feet

    X - 9
    Y - 10
    Z - 11

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    HOW MUCH MOTOR CABLE FOR THE BLACKFOOT?

  • I have theNema 24, 425 Oz stepper motors kit what are my Ports and Pins?

    The ports and pins are designated by the breakout board that you have, Now here are the schematics for both(https://www.buildyourcnc.com/item/electronicsAndMotors-parallel-breakout-relay#prettyPhoto/2/ and https://www.buildyourcnc.com/item/electronicsAndMotors-electronic-component-USB-Controller-Breakout#prettyPhoto/2/) Which for the Parallel the pins will be 1,14,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9. For 1,14 you will need to use them together for a additional axis. Setup will be (ex.mach3) step in (2) / direction pin (3). continued for other pins, 4,5 6,7 etc.
    Now for the USB it has the label on the board right next to the terminal blocks, x-axis/etc.

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    I have theNema 24, 425 Oz stepper motors kit what are my Ports and Pins?

  • I AM USING A XYLOTEX 3 AXIS BOARD AND WANT TO ADD ANOTHER MOTOR SLAVED THE X-AXIS. WILL DRIVE CW230 WORK?

    If the pins from the terminal block on the side of the board are outputs, or at least 2 of them are outputs, then you can connect our modular driver to the board (example: cw230). If they are all inputs, then you would not be able to connect an external driver.

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    I AM USING A XYLOTEX 3 AXIS BOARD AND WANT TO ADD ANOTHER MOTOR SLAVED THE X-AXIS. WILL DRIVE CW230 WORK?